User:Juper0/Responce to Fruipit Blog

Kfm28yUG JuperAdmin

sorry for the book bonjour. welcome to the terraria wiki and thanks for all your help here. I have read all the comments here and the convo you got going on Oscuritaforze's wall. I see you are quite busy here in your first few hours. I also see that you are not just any user from AW, but a renown one. your edits there are remarkable and your position in the badge leaderboard is impressive. congrats on that.

Exsostive Response I, too, come from another wikia. Warframe Wikia (WW) was my home. I have since left and started getting back to real life. I was (still am) an admin there. when i first got into wikia about a year ago, i went to other wikias and looked how they did things. Lots of research so that i would know what to do and not to do for WW. some of those included TW, AW LoLW, starcraft, WoW, dead space, bio shock and so on. I was at a real loss for a while as there are such great differences. how league of legends runs was very different from bio shock. TW and AW are actually not so different as some others are, but one thing that makes them VERY different is that AW is entertainment base, while TW is Video game based. of course you know this; i bring it up as a point of reason to follow into my argument. the focus of AW (from what i understand) is to supplement understanding of a non-interactive world. where as this TW is more about providing easy access to a plethora of info. even to the point of replacing the guide in the game.

that said, I agree that this wiki needs a huge amount of help in getting the info the player, especially new players, in a smooth and concise manner. the main page does not highlight all the most basic info and does highlight things that (imho) are not necessary. the wiki also adds "nomenclatures" that are not in the game. some pages need massive overhauling, maybe even deletion and total rewriting/renaming. I also asked about the whole "different page for every item" policy and got the same answers. I am still new here and I will not argue the policy until i know more about how this community wants the wiki to function. In the WW, we did not tolerate stub pages and making a new page usually met with quite a bit of argument until it was proven by the defending parties that enough relevant info was available to justify a page. I think this has kept the page count considerably low for how popular and extensive the game has become. not to mention how high WW is on the WAM.

(the following is in regards to large and popular wikias. it does not hold true for smaller, often "personal" wikias) My exp. as an admin on WW has also taught me a few lessons on how things become disorganized in a wikia. first, i would like to reiterate Oscuritaforze's point (QUOTE): admins on this wiki are actually equal to other users. On the WW wiki, we actually tried very hard to enforce this ideal. though, we had a different approach. to me, an admin is little more than a "power user." what makes a good admin more than a power user is that they are looked up to by the community to uphold the rules and regulations (policies) of the wiki AND are the ones that take the fall should they not be upheld OR the Terms of Use violated (that is where Wikia Staff come in, but we're not talking about that right now). Thus it can be concluded that anyone with the title Admin is a leader on the wiki in question. sadly, there is no mechanic for admins to reward good contributions without promoting them, but there is a mechanic to punish vandals and spammers. the ban button..... ={   however, some users get leadership from contributing a lot and talking with the community. making lots of blog posts and commenting on page and other's blogs/talk pages. how they talk can make more of a difference than their contributions. on WW I saw that some users were held in high regard and treated as though they had authority, yet had few edits and did not have an admin title, just because they were helping out the community.

as for my second point in regards to admins and order, as was mentioned by Oscuritaforze on his page, admins come and go. this site is about middle aged for its content. terraria just had a major update 3 months ago and that made a lot of new people show up as well as some old timers resurface. but not all of them. some of the inactive people are from a long time ago when the policies were made. policies that did not (could not) account for all the changes in the game and changes in the community. the policies section needs an update. in fact the whole site does. being a community built site, it is the fault of the entire community that this site does live up to exceptional standards. it may be the help on the heads of the admins, but they are volunteers like everyone else. most of them have never even had an internet chat with people who developed the game. many admins have never admin'ed before this. it stands to reason that they will make bad decisions (I know i did on WW) and sometimes loose motivation to fix them or those of other admins/contributors.

so let's give them a break, assume they have lives outside of the wiki and terraria, and do what we can to change things and find the feel of the community then tailor to it. if the wikia is not meeting the desires of the community, then let us simply work together to adjust it appropriately. I have many personal pages i have been working on that take more advantage of the tools wikia provides than currently being employed by the site at large. I have done extensive work on the armors page, liquids page, tools page and a few others and quite a bit of minor work on many more all in hopes to make this wiki better for new users.

tl;dr? I happen to agree with Fruipit (and others) on the stub pages. To me, a wiki is a place to distribute info effectively. there are many ways to do that. TW has chosen one that the old community felt would worked well. Fruipit and I see a different way to do it. we would both like to see things changed for the better and we think we know a better way. I see kida's and Sank Your Battleship's point, but the search bar works even if the item shows up half way down a page. also, the pages for every item can remain, but we can place all the info cleanly on a single page too. i know you may think that a table is worse than a bunch of pages, but if made correctly they are far more effective than a bunch of pages.

for now, I will follow the policies. but I do not think the format is conducive to helping out new players as much as another format.

To Fruipit Modding is actually about half the fun of the game. so those id numbers are hugely important.

To Kida thanks for all the work you do here. is it much appreciated and I hope you continue to contribute for a long time. I respect your position and your contributions here. please consider the following as having a respectful tone.

I think you come on a little to strong to people's comments and complaints. You have a high profile here and people often look to contributors like you (with your green comment box and high number of edits along with that "rollback" title) to get a feel for the community of this wiki. i would say this community is generally softer than LoL Wikia, but that is not saying much. D=

also, being open minded to new ideas and methods is how a wikia grows it community. sometimes that means trying out an idea that may not be appealing and letting it develop until it either dies because the community did not like it or applying it as policy because it works better than previous methods. its one thing to enforce the policies. which you do well. but its another to outright dismiss another's idea like you do here.