User talk:0icke0

AJAX update
Hello again, 0icke0! I just wanted to let you know that there was a tiny bit of progression on the AJAX issue in case you hadn't noticed. I'm sorry for being so pushy (as well as hijacking your talk page, apparently), but I'm rather hesitant of letting everyone's work - yours included - go to waste. I'd do it myself, but it seems someone with admin rights is needed. It doesn't seem to be "much further" now, though! Other than that, perhaps a peek at the game code can resolve this? NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 18:19, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
 * I'll take a look at this next Thursday, till then I'm rather busy. --0icke0 (talk) 08:15, 14 April 2014 (UTC)
 * I saw you had fixed the AJAX! At last Terraria Wiki has a proper means to deal with excessively huge articles! I'm very glad it all resulted in this, so I wanted to properly thank you. The process included several people, but you were the one who ultimately made the desired result possible. I think it's even more impressive that you did so despite a lack of javascript experience - that's what I call a real IT specialist! Without you the whole project would've been flushed down the drain! As such: Thank you for all your help!!! NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 00:57, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

Blood Moons, wooden furniture, and mobile feedback
Good day! There are three things I'm wondering if you could me help with this time.
 * Can you figure out this? Unfortunately it's been some days since it was posted, but the info would still be useful for others.
 * Since any type of Table and Chair can be used as crafting stations for the recipes requiring them, could you remove "Wooden" in Template:Crafting recipe?
 * Do you know if it's possible to post replies on the Mobile Extension Feedback? The way the questions are posted makes me unsure if replies will/can be read.
 * --NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 02:28, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
 * There should indeed be at least one active player with MORE than 120 health for a blood moon to occur. Also the Mobile Extension Feedback seems to be part of the (new?) mobile support of the wiki. I don't know anymore about it than you do, but I find it unlikely that any replies will be read. Also I think it is intended to be used for technical problems with the wiki, not with the game, but that is something for Curse to solve. --0icke0 (talk) 09:52, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Clouds, Living Fire, Sofas, and Stuff
Here are some more tasks I'd like to ask for your assistance on. Sorry for dropping it all on your head at once, it piled up a bit. --NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 02:01, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Some time ago an interesting note was posted on Floating Island, claiming that Clouds increase the number of clouds seen in the background. It'd be cool if they did, but when testing I seem unable to replicate the effect. Do Cloud blocks really spawn clouds?
 * I'd be grateful if you could check if any other blocks (besides Snow and Ice-variants) produce similar effects as well.
 * Exactly what monsters do Living Fire Blocks drop off, and how few/many can drop at once?
 * I agree with the 'plural → singular' suggestion you posted on Sofas. As I don't think it'll call for much discussion you may as well do it. I'd do it myself, but I'm unable to delete the singular-page for moving the plural-page to it in order to preserve page history. Other such pages are Water Fountain, Rack, Trophy, Statue, Rocket, and Block.
 * Perhaps you can answer this? And maybe this?
 * Does Rain really provide a bonus to Fishing?
 * When having a look at Wynthyst's user talk I noticed something that appears to be a scam attempt. I don't like how stuff like this is staying on the page due to Wynthyst being unable to "fight it" himself, so could you remove it? I apologize if this request is inappropriate.
 * From what I can see the number of Cloud blocks does not influence the number of background clouds. I don't think it will be different for other blocks. Living Fire Blocks are dropped by all enemies while they are in the Hell biome during hardmode with a 2% chance. 20-50 blocks are dropped at once. Rain indeed multiplies the bonus from bait+fishing pole+other bonuses by 1.2 (and the other values listed at fishing also multiply the bonus).

Added some GIFs
Hey I added a few gifs to the wiki, since the True Night's Edge, Terra Blade and Death Sickle have ingame animations on their pages I added a few more, they are bit laggy but I hope they will be suitable placeholders until someone adds better versions. I hope they aren't too bad for this wiki, I am new to adding gifs. WelchDrew (talk) 06:37, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Hey, I've taken a look at the images and the quality seems fine. It is clear what the animation is about. I would like to ask though to not have too many things moving around you (pets, summons, etc). I understand it is cool to have them around, but it makes it harder to see what the gif is actually about. Anyway, keep up the good work. --0icke0 (talk) 06:47, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Small Edits
Hi! I'm trying to improve the master templates (grouping them on the same template, making them collapsible, etc. just like the tiles template), your bot would be very helpful when replacing old templates so, thanks in advance! (hope I don't become a nuisance haha). Keep up the good work! --OdnHarfagre (talk) 12:05, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
 * The second template is already done, the templates that must be replaced are:

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Many thanks! --OdnHarfagre (talk) 13:00, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
 * I've started with replacing those texts (considering there are about 400 pages in Category:Weapon items and it only scans 25 pages per 4 or so minutes (api rate limits till the account is marked as a bot) it should take about an hour, but everything seems to be working correctly. --0icke0 (talk) 13:34, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Alright, all done (templates now only link to each other, except for Template:Other Weapons, which is also linked by all consumable templates. --0icke0 (talk) 15:17, 23 May 2014 (UTC)


 * {| class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed"

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 * I've updated the next template, the templates that must be replaced are:

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 * and

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 * }


 * The template is a bit bigger than the others so it will remain collapsed. I've added the template to the consumable weapons by myself so don't worry about them. Many thanks in advance! --OdnHarfagre (talk) 15:58, 25 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Alright they are about done now. --0icke0 (talk) 20:48, 25 May 2014 (UTC)


 * {| class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed"

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 * I've updated the next template, the templates that must be replaced are:

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 * }


 * This template is quite small so it will remain expanded. Many thanks in advance again! --OdnHarfagre (talk) 16:33, 3 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Ok, all done. --0icke0 (talk) 22:12, 3 June 2014 (UTC)


 * {| class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed"

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 * I've updated the next template, the templates that must be replaced are:

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 * This one is big so it will remain collapsed. Once again many thanks in advance! --OdnHarfagre (talk) 23:38, 7 June 2014 (UTC)


 * {| class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed"

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 * I've updated the last template, the templates that must be replaced are:

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 * }


 * This one remains collapsed too. This is the last template that needs updating, many thanks for your help updating them! --OdnHarfagre (talk) 23:37, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Bot flag
You could activate the bot flag for your bot account's edits, to make if easier to filter them out of people's watchlists and recent changes. MediaWiki has this functionality built in. https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Bots

Also I wonder if you could assign me the bot flag right (or assign it to a secondary bot account I create, if that's better) so I can flag my mass automated AutoWikiBrowser (AWB) edits this way. Thanks!  Equazcion ( talk ) 17:37, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately only Bureaucrats/Curse staff can assign additional user rights, such as the bot right. I've already asked Eyes to assign this flag to my new bot account, but so far I have no response. I'm not sure if he is even still active, as his last edit was 1.5 years ago... just like all other Bureaucrats/Curse staff. So if I get no response I'll ask the next random person. Until then I'm marking all my edits as minor, but that's all I can do for now. --0icke0 (talk) 17:47, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Ah that sucks. With the recent redesigns and new wikis there must be someone who can do it. Maybe I'll take a look around myself too. Thanks --  Equazcion ( talk ) 18:07, 23 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Maybe you could ask here. Mods seems to be more active there. --OdnHarfagre (talk) 13:54, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

Lihzahrd Bricks, Fishing, and Placed Walls
I'm back again..!
 * Do Lihzahrd Bricks really increase the spawn rate of enemies?
 * Some time ago a note was added to Fishing. As it conflicted with info already on the page I removed it, but now a user (probably the person who added the note) is telling me the note is correct. When testing in-game it actually seems both pieces of info are correct, as illustrated by this image. Number 1 and 2 (from left) shows that fishing in a 75-tile-high column will work (sorry for not showing the full height), and that removing one tile (bucket) will cause it to not. In 3 and 4 it is shown, as the user described, that fishing through a "pipe" on a surface will not work, and that removing the pipe will. Can you figure out what's going on?
 * I've got a job for your bot! As you know, the wall article (or, its sections, rather) show the appearance of placed walls. I do however think it would be neat if individual wall articles showed this too, in similar manner to Banners and Paintings. A seemingly simple way to apply this is by replacing
 * with:
 * with:


 * Well, a few would need .gifs instead of .pngs, but I can easily fix that myself.

--NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 17:24, 29 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Lihzard Bricks do not increase the spawn rate of enemies. For the water surface width: It checks left and right of the dobber how many tiles of water there are before hitting a wall. Then for all those tiles it checks the depth. This is best explained with an image (with red being the tiles groups it considers valid fishing water and orange the walls where it stops checking). --0icke0 (talk) 18:10, 29 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Ok, almost all have the .gif/.png added now, except Stained Glass, Gemspark Wall, Offline Gemspark Wall, Dungeon Brick Wall. I think for the Dungeon Brick Wall it is kinda unneeded as there is already a preview and for the other pages maybe somewhere else on the page? (putting it in the info box looks ugly) --0icke0 (talk) 19:04, 29 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Ohh, so that's how fishing ponds work. I think the image you made illustrates it quite good (that's some mad MS Paint skills you've got there!!), so I hope you don't mind me using it on the article. As for the walls I agree with your suggestion. I should also have guessed that the bot could add both .gifs and .pngs. As (un)expected of the ‎0icke0bot! NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 23:29, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

British Spelling, Dodge Stacking, and PC-only Entities
It's a lovely day for editing Terraria Wiki! --NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 01:11, 7 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Name changes:
 * Traveling Merchant → Travelling Merchant (see here for reasoning. Edit: seems it's changed from a request to a discussion. For now I'll leave it to your opinion.)
 * Accessories → Accessory
 * Perhaps you can figure out this?
 * Could you have your bot add  to all the 1.2.3 entities? (request based on this edit summary) As some of them already feature the template it may perhaps be easiest to first have the bot remove it, then add/re-add it.
 * Ok, my bot is running (hopefully correctly) now. --0icke0 (talk) 08:05, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

Tabbing, Ocean Fishing, Curse Tickets, and "AJAX-mimics".
--NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 00:41, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * OdnHarfagre has suggested the implementation of tabbing functionality. Could you try add it? Since this would benefit the whole wiki I'll ask you to ignore/postpone all other requests from me until this is fixed (if possible).
 * Terraria game code stuff to figure out:
 * Ocean fishing - I guess it boils down to whether 1000 tiles of water is the only requirement or not.
 * Warmth Potion %
 * Eye of Cthulhu spawn bug
 * Possible Slime Block effect
 * Page title suggestions:
 * Potions → Potion
 * Forests → Forest
 * In regard to your attempts at contacting Curse staff I suggest to simply send them a ticket (here). At least that's how I summoned CrsBenjamin. Given how none of the previous Curse staff on Terraria Wiki seems active it might be reasonable to ask Curse for a new person to fill the role.
 * I'd also like your opinion on the AJAX-imitating collapsible tables I've been experimenting on. The current markup can be found here and pages I've used it on are Accessory and Fishing. Do you think the formatting is good enough? Are the tables unnecessary or confusing?
 * I was going to ask about this, but it seems you beat me to it! :D Not bad!
 * I've recently asked CrsBenjamin about this, so I'll wait a few days for a response before submitting a ticket. Considering someone from curse has to add the Tabber extension to the wiki I'll wait till I get response from that first or otherwise put it in the ticket as well.

--0icke0 (talk) 11:26, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * For ocean fishing the requirement is that there are more than 1000 water tiles and that your dobber is within 380 tiles from the worlds edge (not taking into account that various tiles fall outside then screen, maybe even more depending on the lighting mode). Also the height should still be surface or higher.
 * The Warmth Potion reduces damage from Cold Sources by 30%.
 * The requirements for Eye of Cthulhu have changed from at least 3 NPCs to at least 4 NPCs. Furthermore the player having >=200hp should be the same player as the one having >10 defense. Aside from that I can't find anything that may cause this.
 * I also can't find anything that causes more Slimes to spawn from Slime Blocks.
 * I'm not sure what is causing it, but the new AJAX imitation seems to mess up the Categories bar at the bottom of the page. So I guess that needs to be fixed first. Aside from that, at least on some pages, AJAX is used to prevent things from being loaded until you expand the table. On larger pages this is something you do not want to lose, but you can use collapsible tables on smaller pages.
 * Ow, you were right about the tables messing up. When testing it seems the problem was a lack of closing tags, hopefully it's fixed now. When I made the tables I noticed the page was acting up a bit, but it never occurred to me that the tables were causing it. Thanks for the notice! In regard to how AJAX loads stuff, as I wrote in /Sandbox1 the mimic is intended for content which "arguably doesn't need its own page". As collapsible tables don't "export" anything to other pages it's way out of the question to use it for anything else but minor content. If you compare Informational Accessories with Accessory you'll get an idea of how minor I think a section must be - as long multiple minor sections don't become a lot of content themselves, of course. Other than that, can you figure out this? NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 21:11, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Ok, I've submitted the ticket and now the tabber extension is installed on this wiki (See Terraria Wiki:Sandbox for an example). I've created a simple test template to go with this (currently supports up to 3 tabs, should be easy to extend). If you don't like the style feel free to design another one. I've also requested to get a new liaison, so hopefully within a few days we hear more about that. --0icke0 (talk) 14:43, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Excellent! Thanks again for your work, Terraria Wiki is just getting better and better! I will inform OdnHarfagre so he can start using tabbing in his schemes! NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 01:39, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Page I can't edit
A vandal has just created this page which (evidently due to starting with a /) redirects to http://i_nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn which obviously doesn't exist. I had to go directly to its history page to actually edit it, and I'm not sure if it did get edited properly, so I'm sending this to notify you that it should be deleted. --Xolroc (talk) 18:28, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Okay, it is showing up in the edit history so apparently it has worked. But I'm wondering why it's possible to make a page redirect to an off-wiki page?  Should probably fix that. --Xolroc (talk) 18:30, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Weird. You can still visit such pages by simply going to http://terraria.gamepedia.com/PAGENAME, e.g. http://terraria.gamepedia.com//test. This is properly something curse should fix? Or maybe its the mediawiki software? Either way, it doesn't seem to be a very big problem. --0icke0 (talk) 20:28, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Weird indeed. Should be fixed, but like you said, probably not a huge problem.  I was a bit worried you'd not be able to delete it, though. --Xolroc (talk) 20:29, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Biome spawn rates, minion crits, buff application, and Crimtane
--NoseOfCthulhu (talk) 16:17, 16 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Are certain biomes more suited for invasion arenas?
 * Can minions crit or not? When testing in-game it seems not, but code-confirming would help.
 * Is damage protection from buffs applied before or after defense? → Warmth Potion, Endurance Potion.
 * It seems that invasions overwrite the normal spawn rates, so the biome etc doesn't matter. Moreover it also overwrites spawn rate changes from Battle Potions and Water Candles.
 * From what I can see minions can indeed not crit.
 * The damage protection is applied before defense in case of the Warmth Potion and after in case of the Endurance Potion.
 * Moved the page. --0icke0 (talk) 09:52, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

Curse-made Terraria videos
Hi there, I'm your new primary Curse contact since Wyn's passing. I apologise for just leaping in, but needs must. Our video content manager is very interested in making gameplay videos for Terraria. Would you be interested / willing to have this sort of content on Terraria Wiki, and in particular on the main page ? — Game widow (talk) 23:38, 16 July 2014 (UTC)
 * This greatly depends on the type of videos. A little history may be needed for this. In that past we had various problems with videos, mainly because they tended to explain in 5 minutes what could be explained in 2 sentences. Furthermore they were focused on self promotion, rather than on contributing to the overall quality of the wiki. As a result a Video Policy was created. This also to prevent certain problems they had with videos on the other wiki, resulting in significant (edit) wars and poor quality content. Recently it has been recovering from this, slowly improving the quality. I have little desire to reverse that process on this wiki. So if the videos are just about explaining things that are already well presented on the wiki I don't think it would be a good idea. If it is just another person playing the game many thousands of such videos can already be found on Youtube, which is the location most people interested in this would look. But if the videos would indeed contribute to the overall quality of the wiki or in some way be interesting for the visitors of this wiki I'm willing to consider it. As for the other admins that you've asked, as far as I know they are all long inactive. I've recently tried to contact some of them, but without success. If you want to hear more opinions about this I suggest asking some other active members on this wiki, mainly: Equazcion, NoseOfCthulhu and Xolroc. --0icke0 (talk) 11:02, 17 July 2014 (UTC)


 * I'll chime in here since I noticed this. I'd pretty much echo what 0icke0 says above. I've tried to do my part to keep the quality high here, prune the extraneous fan cruft stuff, get things streamlined, and make this wiki an efficient reference for people who just want to find relevant pieces of info. I think gameplay videos would be a move in the opposite direction. If I had to think of a way videos could help here, there might be a couple situations where tiny videos might be useful to illustrate mechanics that are difficult to describe textually. That's all though, in my opinion. Also regarding the Wikia situation, I was editing the Wikia wiki myself before I came to this one, and had experienced the video issues there; It's why I ended up coming here instead. It would be a shame if something like that ended up happening here. If videos end up here, we should have assurances that promotion of those videos wouldn't become a motivating factor, and that editors can remove them from these pages if they decide it's best. That's if videos end up here -- I'm not saying they should.  Equazcion ( talk ) 12:32, 17 Jul 2014 (UTC)


 * I personally don't like seeing videos on wikis; they seem to break the flow of the page, especially if a gif could be used instead. I feel like the situations Equazcion listed where "tiny" videos would be useful would all be situations where we could simply use a gif, which is less troublesome to users (no need to click play, no need to check audio, no need to allow it past noscript if they use it) and easier to embed.  Especially with such short videos as these would be, I feel that any intro and outro would be the vast majority of the video, making it essentially advertisement for Curse, even if unintentional.  Overall, my vote on the topic is no, we should not include videos in the wiki.  However, I will note that I would not be opposed to having such videos on Youtube with links at the bottom of wiki pages, in a style akin to references; simply a "videos" section with a link to the (off-site) video. --Xolroc (talk) 15:24, 17 July 2014 (UTC)


 * I've passed on your comments and concerns to our video content manager and i think it would work best if he explained himself directly to you, so i'm asking him to continue with this discussion thread. Thanks! — Game widow (talk) 20:46, 20 July 2014 (UTC)


 * Hi there, thanks for taking the time to respond, really appreciate it. I am Mitch I am the head video guy for the Curse-Gampepedia YouTube channel. Just to touch on a few points made, to shed some light on the situation.


 * 1) I completely agree that the Wiki in itself is a near complete repository of information on Terraria, in fact, I use it all the time! Having said that, I would be remiss to not point out that the mean Terraria age is one of, if not the biggest audience of Youtube videos. Many people are not just visual learners, they are a combination of visual, auditory and kinesthetic, as I am sure you are all aware. Videos try and entertain as well as inform the 'here and now' generation. It would be used as a tool to drive traffic to your wiki and vice versa. Minecraft or minecraft.gamepedia.com is a great example of how videos compliment a wiki, as their numbers are too large to ignore. It will not be a Minecraft Spotlights clone, however they do drive a large amount of traffic to the wiki - https://www.youtube.com/user/mcspotlights


 * 2) I would take responsibility for the content. What this means is, I would create content for popular pages, as dictated by analytics, however I am open to any/all feedback. Sure, I cannot please everyone at all times and I am sorry if an idea isn't actioned because of whatever reason... but realistically this means you wouldn't have crappy 30 min gameplay embedded willy nilly, I would keep a standard and style that holds true to the wikis core practices.


 * 3) I love what I do. I am passionate about making the best Terraria videos ever... period. I get paid by Gamepedia, yes, but I can cover just about any game. I have chosen to 'take on' Terraria, because I feel that it is a beautiful game that has a nice energy and pacing... something I would love to talk about, week in week out. Having said that, I am acutely aware, that you probably love Terraria more than myself and am in awe of the dedication of wiki admins that I have the pleasure of working with, so again, appreciate the consideration.


 * So, in short, if you would be open to the idea, I would like to make an attempt at a video for the wiki, to show value, then if all goes well, it will be a nice symbiotic relationship where everyone benefits and we all wear top hats to celebrate...and everyone is happy for ever and ever.


 * Really appreciate your time,
 * - Mitch/DashDingo


 * I think Xolroc summed up a primary concern about breaking the flow of wiki pages. I might give this a shot if we could put the videos in collapsible templates, collapsed by default, that can be expanded when people want to see them. We could create a new template for this, something that stands out uniquely but integrates with the wiki flow, rather than making the standard honkin' YouTube embedded player box appear on pages. Though I'm still concerned about the promotion issue, which I don't think has really been addressed.  Equazcion ( talk ) 07:08, 21 Jul 2014 (UTC)

I've watched some of the videos on the Minecraft wiki and the quality is indeed good, its objective and there is no begging for subscriptions. And there may indeed be a group of people who prefer watching over reading. So if it can be nicely integrated in the wiki I'm not against it. What I'm mainly concerned about is how other people will react to this. Likely they also want to add their (crappy) videos to the wiki and replacing the existing ones (as happened on the other wiki). There may be some ways to reduce this problem (move the video to a protected sub page, as done with NPC names, or add a link to the policy below each video), but if anyone has some good ideas please share them. EDIT: maybe the best way to do this is to use a template to include the videos from a sub page and add a small link on how to add videos (linking to the video policy) below that. As most people won't know how to add videos in that case they will have to follow the link, read on the video policy and we explain at the bottom of the video policy how it works. Although making it more complicated for people to use the wiki, it will prevent most poor quality videos and still allow everyone to add videos to the wiki if needed. --0icke0 (talk) 10:48, 21 July 2014 (UTC)
 * I like 0icke0's suggestion with how to keep the videos protected from people messing with them, but as Equazcion summed up my primary concern is how the media player interrupts the page. The minecraft wiki you used as an example is in fact an example of what I dislike: large video players in the middle of the page that simply don't seem like they belong there. --Xolroc (talk) 14:09, 21 July 2014 (UTC)
 * User:0icke0, are you saying this would basically mean getting rid of the no-video policy? Could we mandate that only Curse videos are allowed, or would that run contrary to the wiki way... I think deciding which videos should be stay is going to be a really subjective task. Who decides and how would we decide which stay?  Equazcion ( talk ) 16:52, 21 Jul 2014 (UTC)
 * I would indeed prefer not to make exceptions to the rules for certain people. But you're right that it may be hard to judge what is allowed and what is not. I guess we can go for the easy option and if someone thinks this is really unfair and wants his videos added we can always discuss that later. --0icke0 (talk) 08:49, 22 July 2014 (UTC)


 * Heya, thanks for opening this up for discussion between yourselves! I unfortunately will not be able to get any content happening for Terraria for a few weeks, so I may have jumped the gun a bit. Who should I contact in regards to projected videos in the future, or do you guys rpefer if I drop the ideas here? Thanks again.
 * - Mitch/DashDingo
 * Feel free to contact me here again. (Not sure what the others prefer?) --0icke0 (talk) 20:39, 27 July 2014 (UTC)
 * I'll just keep a watch on here I suppose. --Xolroc (talk) 20:41, 27 July 2014 (UTC)

Bots
Your bot account is now bot-flagged, and I've got one now too: User:EquazcionBot. See User talk:Equazcion. I'm guessing we now know who to contact for bureaucrat stuff -- User:Cblair91. :)  Equazcion ( talk ) 17:51, 30 Aug 2014 (UTC)